Comments on: Greeks Bearing Blogs, and Brickbats http://citmedia.org/blog/2008/10/22/greeks-bearing-blogs-and-brickbats/ Sat, 24 Oct 2009 22:49:29 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Dan Gillmor http://citmedia.org/blog/2008/10/22/greeks-bearing-blogs-and-brickbats/comment-page-1/#comment-2748 Dan Gillmor Fri, 24 Oct 2008 10:08:29 +0000 http://citmedia.org/blog/?p=1494#comment-2748 Craig, I'm sorry to hear that bloggers feel so aggrieved with the pro journalists and educators. I know the conference organizers were trying to spark a real conversation. Craig, I’m sorry to hear that bloggers feel so aggrieved with the pro journalists and educators. I know the conference organizers were trying to spark a real conversation.

]]> By: Dan Gillmor http://citmedia.org/blog/2008/10/22/greeks-bearing-blogs-and-brickbats/comment-page-1/#comment-2747 Dan Gillmor Fri, 24 Oct 2008 10:02:27 +0000 http://citmedia.org/blog/?p=1494#comment-2747 Nikos, It was one of the items that kept coming up during the conference, and something I'm especially concerned with in this era. People are free to not use their names. But they should not start off with the same credibilty of people who do; it should be much less, and when it's an attack there should be less than zero credibility. Nikos,

It was one of the items that kept coming up during the conference, and something I’m especially concerned with in this era.

People are free to not use their names. But they should not start off with the same credibilty of people who do; it should be much less, and when it’s an attack there should be less than zero credibility.

]]> By: Jon Garfunkel http://citmedia.org/blog/2008/10/22/greeks-bearing-blogs-and-brickbats/comment-page-1/#comment-2746 Jon Garfunkel Fri, 24 Oct 2008 03:56:47 +0000 http://citmedia.org/blog/?p=1494#comment-2746 re: "the default position should be to actively disbelieve what we’ve read or heard." What Seth said. also: As I like to say in my office, da-fault is with da-user. (I kid! I kid!) Shankar Vedantam of the WashPost has been reporting for the last year about the futility of fighting rumors. Ping us when you've re-programmed human psychology. Haven't we discussed this before here...? A long time ago, in a campaign moment far, far away, you were <a href="/blog/2007/03/22/some-lessons-from-the-big-sister-anti-clinton-video/" rel="nofollow">trying to get people</a> to pay no attention to the Hillary Clinton "Big Brother" video. My sense is, the thing that drives viral information is the sourcelessness of it. (and what do you have to say to the fact that the author(s) of the bestselling book of all time are unknown...?) re: “the default position should be to actively disbelieve what we’ve read or heard.”

What Seth said.
also:

As I like to say in my office, da-fault is with da-user. (I kid! I kid!)

Shankar Vedantam of the WashPost has been reporting for the last year about the futility of fighting rumors. Ping us when you’ve re-programmed human psychology.

Haven’t we discussed this before here…? A long time ago, in a campaign moment far, far away, you were trying to get people to pay no attention to the Hillary Clinton “Big Brother” video. My sense is, the thing that drives viral information is the sourcelessness of it.

(and what do you have to say to the fact that the author(s) of the bestselling book of all time are unknown…?)

]]> By: Delia http://citmedia.org/blog/2008/10/22/greeks-bearing-blogs-and-brickbats/comment-page-1/#comment-2745 Delia Fri, 24 Oct 2008 01:58:02 +0000 http://citmedia.org/blog/?p=1494#comment-2745 I agree with Nikos and strongly disagree with that statement on anonymity. Especially with the way it is constructed: it uses *an example* of a negative use of anonymity (personal attacks) to justify dismissing anonymous criticism without considering the quality of the criticism. Delia P.S. Valid criticism that spells out the logical steps does not need an identifiable "author" -- it is just as true (and useful) if you don't know the author as if you do. It is a mistake to ignore it just because it is anonymous. D. I agree with Nikos and strongly disagree with that statement on anonymity. Especially with the way it is constructed: it uses *an example* of a negative use of anonymity (personal attacks) to justify dismissing anonymous criticism without considering the quality of the criticism.

Delia

P.S. Valid criticism that spells out the logical steps does not need an identifiable “author” — it is just as true (and useful) if you don’t know the author as if you do. It is a mistake to ignore it just because it is anonymous.

D.

]]> By: Craig Wherlock http://citmedia.org/blog/2008/10/22/greeks-bearing-blogs-and-brickbats/comment-page-1/#comment-2744 Craig Wherlock Thu, 23 Oct 2008 20:08:55 +0000 http://citmedia.org/blog/?p=1494#comment-2744 I think the conference has sparked off something of a war between bloggers and the more traditional journalists/ journalism educators. The vast majority of the Geek language bloggers mentioned above were highly critical the running of the conference and the stance of many of the academics taking part. I think the organisers failed to understand that bloggers, unlike most of the students who attended the conference, are not dependent on the professors/professional journalists for either grades or future career connections. In that respect the debate sparked off by the event was a breath of fresh air and a warning to some that the ability by a few to set and control a news agenda is coming under threat. BTW you go rave reviews from the bloggers. I think the conference has sparked off something of a war between bloggers and the more traditional journalists/ journalism educators. The vast majority of the Geek language bloggers mentioned above were highly critical the running of the conference and the stance of many of the academics taking part.

I think the organisers failed to understand that bloggers, unlike most of the students who attended the conference, are not dependent on the professors/professional journalists for either grades or future career connections.

In that respect the debate sparked off by the event was a breath of fresh air and a warning to some that the ability by a few to set and control a news agenda is coming under threat.

BTW you go rave reviews from the bloggers.

]]> By: Nikos Anagnostou http://citmedia.org/blog/2008/10/22/greeks-bearing-blogs-and-brickbats/comment-page-1/#comment-2743 Nikos Anagnostou Thu, 23 Oct 2008 12:14:16 +0000 http://citmedia.org/blog/?p=1494#comment-2743 Dan, I noticed that you changed your post (adding the anonymity part) to an extend that anonymity became the major theme of the post. What, really, drove you to make this change? Dan, I noticed that you changed your post (adding the anonymity part) to an extend that anonymity became the major theme of the post. What, really, drove you to make this change?

]]> By: Dan Gillmor http://citmedia.org/blog/2008/10/22/greeks-bearing-blogs-and-brickbats/comment-page-1/#comment-2742 Dan Gillmor Thu, 23 Oct 2008 08:39:33 +0000 http://citmedia.org/blog/?p=1494#comment-2742 Seth, it's a primary element of the new book I'm working on. We have to help people become more critical thinkers. This will take parents, schools and (especially) traditional media's involvement. It's not an overnight thing, but a generational project.... Seth, it’s a primary element of the new book I’m working on. We have to help people become more critical thinkers. This will take parents, schools and (especially) traditional media’s involvement.

It’s not an overnight thing, but a generational project….

]]> By: Seth Finkelstein http://citmedia.org/blog/2008/10/22/greeks-bearing-blogs-and-brickbats/comment-page-1/#comment-2741 Seth Finkelstein Wed, 22 Oct 2008 16:44:27 +0000 http://citmedia.org/blog/?p=1494#comment-2741 "the default position should be ..." Yes, Dan. It should. It <em>should</em>. IT <b>SHOULD</b>. It isn't. Now what? [It's not a very good answer to say you'll just keep repeating it - that doesn't go too far in terms of solution.] “the default position should be …”

Yes, Dan. It should. It should. IT SHOULD.

It isn’t.

Now what?

[It's not a very good answer to say you'll just keep repeating it - that doesn't go too far in terms of solution.]

]]> By: magica http://citmedia.org/blog/2008/10/22/greeks-bearing-blogs-and-brickbats/comment-page-1/#comment-2740 magica Wed, 22 Oct 2008 15:48:28 +0000 http://citmedia.org/blog/?p=1494#comment-2740 As Nikos said, it will be good if we meet you again in a "different" conference for blogging and citizen journalism. In a conference where people "don't afraid" the blogging and bloggers. You are always welcome in Thessaloniki. As Nikos said, it will be good if we meet you again in a “different” conference for blogging and citizen journalism. In a conference where people “don’t afraid” the blogging and bloggers.

You are always welcome in Thessaloniki.

]]> By: Dan Gillmor http://citmedia.org/blog/2008/10/22/greeks-bearing-blogs-and-brickbats/comment-page-1/#comment-2739 Dan Gillmor Wed, 22 Oct 2008 15:21:50 +0000 http://citmedia.org/blog/?p=1494#comment-2739 Thanks, Nikos -- I do think that there's a willingness to listen, however, despite the fears. Attitudes take time to change.... Thanks, Nikos — I do think that there’s a willingness to listen, however, despite the fears. Attitudes take time to change….

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